[Denis MacDougall]: On March 29th, 2023, Governor Healey signed into law a supplemental budget bill, which, among other things, extends the temporary provisions pertaining to the open meeting law to March 31st, 2025. Specifically, this further extension allows public bodies to continue holding meetings remotely without quorum of the public body physically present at the meeting location, and to provide adequate alternative access to remote meetings. The language does not make any substantive changes to the open meeting law other than... And once again, I forgot to hit record. Recording was going on. Never mind. On the day, um, the delay, which is something that changes the open meeting rather than extending the expiration date of the temporary provisions regarding remote meetings, March 31st, 2023, March 31st, 2025. I'll read the first item on the agenda. Notice of intent to EP file number 215-0235, South Reservoir Dam Improvements, continue to November 1st. The Town of Winchester has filed a notice of intent to conduct improvements to the South Reservoir Dam on South Dam Road in Medford, Mass., to bring it into compliance with the Office of Dam Safety Regulations. The proposed work will impact the following inland resource areas, bordering vegetated wetlands, bank, land under water bodies and waterways, bordering land subject to flooding, and the River Hearn area, Snell to Brooke. This project is being filed as a Dam Maintenance Limited Project, Part 310, CMR 10.533i.
[MCM00001336_SPEAKER_08]: Sure, so we presented this project back in October. I thought I could start by going through a couple responses to some of the questions that came up during that meeting. Dennis, do you want me to pull up my screen? We submitted a package with some additional information yesterday morning. I'm assuming not everybody got a chance to get through any of that additional information yet, but I'll just kind of summarize what we submitted. So we performed the wildlife habitat assessment. So that's in the package. Yeah, I saw that. I don't know if we need to kind of go through that whole thing. But if anybody has any questions, we can talk about that. We also provided a compensatory storage memo. We've been in discussion with DEP And the messaging that we're getting from Kyle at DEP is that the project will be approved as is, but he requested some additional information discussing the compensatory storage and kind of some of the site constraints and what we're working with here on that. So that's included in our submittal.
[Heidi Davis]: And just to clarify, that approval is for the 401 water quality certification?
[MCM00001336_SPEAKER_08]: Correct. One other topic that came up during the last meeting, I'm going to jump to page 82 of the package. There were some concerns about BVW impacts temporary versus permanent downstream of the filter blanket. And I can pull up another plan if we want to after. But this is a figure that we extracted from our modeling of the dam. So the pink line you're seeing here is the groundwater table. And you can see the flow of water coming through the dam. Here's the BBW area on a section view. Here's the filter blanket. That's the fill within the BBW. And you can see the groundwater is emerging downstream of the filter blanket into that BBW area that we're calling as temporary impacts. So this is just kind of a figure showing that we think that the BBW area downstream of the filter blanket can be a successful wetland after the project's constructed. One other request from the last meeting was a cut fill table. We provided that, there was some minor updates to that. One tricky thing with the cut fill table, this site is in a zone A flood area, so there's no set elevation for the flood zone. How we're showing the blood zone is, you know, it's basically a tracing of the ferment mapping. And that spans across a lot of different elevations, especially on this site with the top of the dam, you know, 40 feet higher than the Swellbrook below. So we pulled together the cut-fill table. We added some notes to that. And I guess just keep that in mind as you're reviewing that about how that was drafted. Um, I had the plans, I think that at the end of this package. So, there was really a ton of updates to the plans. Uh, 1 thing we did add. As requested is the buffer zone. For the toe of the dam, we're showing the 20 foot buffer zone now on the plans. Um, that was, I think, just a request from last meeting because we were talking about, you know, water and trees within 20 feet of the toe of the dam. And we also just clarified on the note sheet and added some language on operation and maintenance of the erosion controls during the project and throughout the project. The only other piece that we kind of left open-ended on my end from the last meeting is the trees. Um, we were hoping to get a little guidance from the commission on the trees, uh, because we're obviously taking down a lot of trees here. Um, so we were looking for some guidance that, you know, the town of Winchester is agreeable, um, you know, to working, working with the commission on, um, on how we're going to handle all the trees that are being cut down. So, um, I don't know if, if there's anything to report from on the commission side on that, um, But I mean, we can open it up to discussion now on any of those topics that I just touched based on if anybody would like more detail on on any of those things.
[Heidi Davis]: Can somebody fill me in on the discussion on trees that the commission is going to have?
[Heather]: Basically, the number of trees that are going, especially those absolutely fabulous trees, we were looking at potential places for replacing. I know that as soon as I got off the meeting, I got in touch with Amanda in terms of the tree group in town, and I believe that, Dennis, you were going to talk to Aggie? because there's lots of projects that are ongoing and it would make sense that Winchester, Medford, and folks that are already involved get together. But Dennis, I have not heard anything back since then.
[Craig Drennan]: You're muted, Dennis.
[Denis MacDougall]: Thank you. There's something going on in the chambers and I hear applause and clapping every now and again. So I have to mute. So, cause it just sounds very weird. Um, maybe you can't even hear it, but, um, so I, I've, I talked to Aggie like right after the initial meeting and I've tried being contacted, but I honestly haven't seen her. So I'm not sure if she's not around right now. So I, I, I need to like, I actually just emailed her again last week after I heard back from, uh, from Haley, just so I, but I haven't heard back from her. So I don't know if maybe she's just out. So I gotta, I'll double check with the office, DPW office and see what that is. But I mean, I think, I mean, ideally, you know, with both Therese Medford and Aggie, I think we can, sort of come to a pretty good, you know, having those folks involved, I think, are probably the two best groups, two best, you know, forces for the city in terms of, like, finding places for trees to go.
[Heather]: And also, I don't know if we have any involvement per se, but along the river where we just had a massive tree kill-off, you know, down near the court on our way headed toward Assembly Square, you know, that section of the parkland along there. I don't want to take a lot of time up on that, but I mean, I've counted at least 20 trees that have been involved in that kill-off, and I don't know if there's perhaps something else we can do down there as well.
[Denis MacDougall]: Unfortunately, I think that's probably DCR land, so I'm not sure if that's something we want to tie this into, but we could... I bet Amanda and the tree folks would be more than happy to work cooperatively.
[Denis MacDougall]: I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know.
[Heather]: I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know.
[Heidi Davis]: I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know We're not quite there yet, but we need to keep that in mind.
[Heather]: The only other thing I wanted to say is thank you very much for the wildlife report. Trust me, I read it as well as many, many, many other pages today. And thank you.
[MCM00001336_SPEAKER_08]: Yep, no problem.
[Heather]: I have no questions. I mean, it was self-explanatory.
[Craig Drennan]: I've got a follow up I was on being annoying about the ordering vegetated wetland within that 20 foot buffer zone. Um, the. Geotech modeling you guys provided. Yep, the help it definitely does show the water table kind of, you know. Meeting ground surface, but 1 thing I would like to see for 1 that doesn't have I don't see mention here of. You know, wetland mixed restoration to kind of restore that to what we have at that, which I think, you know, if it's now, let's make it later. And in addition, I know that the dam safety bureaus rule is no trees within 20 feet. And to me, the easiest way at a given dam would be to mow within that 20 foot buffer. I'd like to see some sort of maintenance plan that shows how you're going to maintain that as a wetland without mowing it down, but removing trees as they pop up. Because if it's a wetland, it shouldn't get mowed every year. Those two things stick out to me. Everything else looks good. I appreciate seeing the buffer on the plans. That makes things a lot easier to wrap my head around. But yeah, that's everything that I had to follow up on the threads I left open after our last meeting.
[MCM00001336_SPEAKER_08]: Okay, thank you, yeah, the plan is to use wetland seed mix in that area. And I'll look into the O&M of that area. Great, thank you.
[Heidi Davis]: So, unfortunately, I wasn't here for the last hearing. But I did want to make sure that the commission is aware of the language the limited project exemptions. I did read something in the application that alluded to that basically performance standards are waived for limited projects and that is not the case. The regulations do clearly state that the issuing authority may issue an order and may impose such as conditions as will contribute to the interest of the act. And so it's The section intends that performance standards are met to the maximum extent possible. I just wanted to make sure that everybody was clear on that. And excuse me for not having a voice. We don't review that many here, so I just wanted to make sure that you all, the commission was aware of that.
[Heather]: Thank you.
[MCM00001336_SPEAKER_08]: That language is quoted in that additional compensatory storage memo that we provided. So a snip of that language, I believe, is in there.
[Heidi Davis]: Great. I'm glad to hear it. Thank you. Awesome.
[Craig Drennan]: And I just, Craig, you finish. Well, one thing I'd add is with the compensatory storage and kind of the flood stuff, This is zone A up against a reservoir that's controlled by active operators. Personally, as a water resource engineer, I'm not concerned about loss of flood storage because it comes down to an operations decision. And I appreciate the addition of compensatory storage downstream of the dam. So I'm not all that concerned about the loss of, granted it is in the WPA that is wording within the act. I'm happy with what I see here in the plan.
[Heidi Davis]: Thanks, Greg. That's helpful.
[MCM00001336_SPEAKER_08]: That's also in there. We did get into a little bit about how it's managed by the Town of Winchester's Water Department. And they're always watching the wet weather. They have a weather service that they work with and rain gauges that are monitored daily. And they take water level readings throughout. I don't know if it's every week or what the time frame is on that, but they're always monitoring the water level out there.
[EO-vAhUJAKo_SPEAKER_18]: And if I'll just pop my, I just have one question, if you could just give us an update on the other permits, any additional updates you have.
[MCM00001336_SPEAKER_08]: So the 401 permit, I believe is awaiting Conservation Commission approval or the order or conditioning. The Army Corps permit was, then the public notice went out on I think went out on Halloween. So there's a 30, Haley correct me if I'm wrong, I think it's a 30 day waiting period or something from Halloween until anything happens with that permit. But we have monthly meetings with them and everything seems to be moving. I don't think currently they're waiting on anything from us. I think it's this Conservation Commission order of conditions that their DEP is waiting for and Army Corps is just moving through their process now.
[EO-vAhUJAKo_SPEAKER_18]: Okay, and is it, this is kind of more to the commission members, do we typically, would we typically wait until the Army Corps has issued their decision before we would... Army Corps is waiting for 401's approval.
[MCM00001336_SPEAKER_08]: Is waiting for... And 401's waiting for your approval.
[Heidi Davis]: Okay. No, we do not need to have the 404 issued part two. So I understand, of course, that there is a lack of one-to-one mitigation for BVW, land underwater, riverfront area, and BLSF, of course, is in cubic yards. So, and given that the issuing authority may impose such conditions as contribute to the act. I wanted the commission to think about some possibilities. I noticed in the response document on both page 12 and figure 1.3, there's areas, existing areas of bittersweet. Yes. So I want us to consider, I know that there's invasive monitoring proposed for the replication area, but this is separate. This would be mitigation for existing invasives that are within the riverfront area. And so I wanted to just bring up that idea to you all.
[Craig Drennan]: I tried this, Heidi. I had this same last meeting. I tried.
[Heidi Davis]: Yes, we can impose such conditions as we believe contribute to the interest of the.
[Craig Drennan]: Okay, there's also not, we did and a bunch of other junk in the pond to the West of the dam as well.
[MCM00001336_SPEAKER_08]: As you drive in and we did bring up the invasive species removal. With an army core. and they are not recognizing that as mitigation.
[Heidi Davis]: And those are separate permits with a separate process. And just because DEP is not going to require that, you know, the water quality certification only addresses BVW and land underwater. It does not address riverfront area, buffer zone, bank or BLSF. And that's how our permits are different. The Wetlands Protection Act is a different vehicle.
[MCM00001336_SPEAKER_08]: Yep, we brought that up with them as, you know, hoping to reduce and increase our mitigation with those permits as well. I just wanted to let you guys know that we did follow up on that and propose that.
[Heidi Davis]: To DEP?
[MCM00001336_SPEAKER_08]: With DEP and Army Corps, we brought it up at our last meeting, yeah.
[Heidi Davis]: But they're not the issuing authority here for the Wetlands Protection Act permit that's before us. They can do what they want with their 401 and 404, so I'm not sure of the relevance.
[MCM00001336_SPEAKER_01]: I think he's just trying to clarify that we did bring it up to see if we could do a two-for-one, getting some Army Corps and the 401 to buy in as well. We understand at the end of the day, the CONCOM has their own review of everything, but just trying to say, be discussed as well with them just to see if we could do a two-for-one benefit.
[MCM00001336_SPEAKER_08]: We did go down that avenue with them is all I was trying to say. Thank you for clarifying it.
[Heidi Davis]: I appreciate it.
[Heather]: And I will say that I got a feeling that my friends on the commission, we all had an interest in certainly some of the invasive cleanup. We were very pleased with that recommendation.
[Craig Drennan]: And it maybe could be tied to the net change in impact as a thought to throw something out there. of an order of conditions, but I'm not exactly sure how we would go about tying, you know, removal to effort or area.
[Heidi Davis]: Well, so this would something that would, of course, the proponent would have to be amenable to. or if not amenable. But we could always condition a permit requiring such, and it could, you know, then it's subject to appeal. That's another route. And so that permit would then go to DEP for a superseding order of conditions. Or we could get concurrence from the proponent that they would be amenable to preparing such a plan prior to construction of the project.
[MCM00001336_SPEAKER_08]: Yeah, I mean, the town of Winchester is, you know, willing to definitely work with the commission. You know, we were looking down that avenue of the invasive species removal. I believe, Craig, you said you were looking specifically at an area coming into the treatment plant and then an area along Smeltbrook as well.
[Craig Drennan]: Yeah, I mean, I was, I think Caroline, Heather, and I were all on site with you. That just stuck out to me on the driveway, and there's a small pond to the west of the dam that looked to me to have knotweed studs to me. I wouldn't be surprised if there was other stuff out there. Heidi raised oriental bittersweet out in the seepage wetlands. That's flagged in the have-had assessment you provided. Those are two areas granted. It's the fell. There's invasive to be had if you go close enough, but those are two areas off the cuff.
[MCM00001336_SPEAKER_08]: I can talk to the town about that and I do think they would be agreeable if that was required.
[Heidi Davis]: We would appreciate that if you could speak with them about that.
[MCM00001336_SPEAKER_08]: Okay. And would you be looking for a plan, so you'd be looking for a plan submitted?
[Heidi Davis]: We could conceivably condition an order to require the plan and not have the plan in hand to issue the order.
[Craig Drennan]: Okay.
[Heidi Davis]: So we could move ahead, Heidi, as you're saying. Well, yeah, we can. But before we do that, we have the matter of the fact that we received an awful lot of information this morning. And so just procedurally, Dennis, how many days are we supposed to receive this substantially before a hearing, I believe?
[Denis MacDougall]: Usually about, you know, I would say I mean, I don't think we have anything set in stone, but it's usually more than a day, which is, yeah.
[Craig Drennan]: So I don't need to work out trees. So that's, that's something on the docket too. That's true.
[Denis MacDougall]: That'll give us, and I'll be able to maybe get a little better handle on what I use up to. And also we can dial back in with trees in Edford.
[MCM00001336_SPEAKER_08]: I mean, I, I kind of anticipated, um,
[Heather]: Discontinuing again, but I we did want to you know come in and provide what we did have for information and answer any questions Yeah, no, that's great Yeah, they you have answered a number of questions, I just think these are some continuing issues dennis um I know that agate has a lot on her plate, but um if you could I'd be happy to to work in and around this issue, and with Amanda and the tree folks as well. I've already, I mean, I immediately emailed them, so they should be aware. Also, I've read their recent letter.
[Denis MacDougall]: Yeah, you had, you had, you had MCC on that as well, and, I mean, she, she emailed right away saying, you know, we'd be happy to help out more than anybody can. So I know, I think we have the support of the trees management, which is good. And then I think we just, it's just getting Aggie on board with the, with our tree department.
[Heather]: But I'm trying to have him on, on the mitigation aspect, as Heidi pointed out, we need to be. clear about exactly what we want to do and what we're expecting.
[EO-vAhUJAKo_SPEAKER_18]: And on that, Heather, I don't know if you have any idea what your thoughts are. Were you thinking they would be donating like bare root trees to us or doing the actual installation? Did you have any thoughts or we still need to?
[Heather]: Basically, I would leave this up to Aggie and the folks. But I know there's extensive plans for all over the community. My guess is they could really quickly come up with a response. It's just a matter of pulling the people together and getting it to happen. especially the tree people are, and Aggie is always very responsive, but the tree folks are definitely planning way ahead. So, yeah. They're doing a lot of tree root stuff right now, but I think they'd like as much help as they can get.
[Heidi Davis]: I think bare root would be difficult to take hold and there'd be a threat of invasives. Exactly.
[Denis MacDougall]: Well, I can, when we did the previous work here, I think, you know, we put in and it was, you know, the trees that got replaced, we, it was a similar type thing where the trees that got taken down couldn't be put there. So, at that instance, we actually put them in different spots in Winchester near resource areas. You know, we, I remember just going driving around with the guy who was in charge of the, The water, he still is actually, but he just literally drove around Winchester. And the first time we went around picking places, just looking for places to plant. And then six months later when they were planting, I went down and he showed me where they had gotten put in.
[Heather]: I don't think a lot of this, Heidi, would occur probably in the fells. It would probably occur in other places in the community. Because they also try to pair it up so that there's caretakers.
[MCM00001336_SPEAKER_08]: I don't know if we could work a number of trees to be determined, location to be determined, and wherever it is. I don't know if there's any interest in like some kind of benching in the area. I know there's a lot of, you know, walking trails in the area, maybe some benches along, a spot along the trails within the fells with some, you know, some type of plantings around the benches. We've done some work on some of the dams that are located in Winchester, and we did some work like that.
[Denis MacDougall]: Do you have any, well, Mike, do you have any, like, either even just photos or things like that and stuff that hasn't already been done or it's been approved that there's any stuff like that. If you want to send that to us just so we can take a look and see what's been proposed.
[Heather]: My personal feeling is I'm much more interested in invasives and tree planting more long-term.
[Craig Drennan]: Yeah, the fells trails don't really have all that many benches on them to start with. Having typed a bunch of them, so adding adding benches to some of them, I don't think would make that big a difference. In terms of number of trees, I mean, you've got a number of trees for removal. That's a good starting point.
[Heidi Davis]: I also thought that this land was water supply land and it wasn't exactly open to the public. Around the reservoirs.
[Heather]: You can walk through there and around there, yeah.
[Craig Drennan]: Those are areas that are not open to the public, but hikers find their way.
[Heidi Davis]: Yes. Oh, I do know that. And there was a time where there was a guy with a red truck that would chase you.
[MCM00001336_SPEAKER_08]: He's still around. Is he? Yeah. So there's three reservoirs within the Fells. There's the north, the middle, and the south, and the land around the treatment plant. where we are now is closed to the public even though it's very active. The south reservoir and the middle are open to the public currently.
[Heather]: Is this our biggest sticking point at this point just in general team members?
[Heidi Davis]: I don't think so we're still at the point we haven't got there yet.
[MCM00001336_SPEAKER_08]: It's kind of circling there. Do you want me to find locations in Winchester for the trees? I was kind of proposing to plant them somewhere in Medford, but... I prefer Medford.
[Craig Drennan]: Me too.
[Denis MacDougall]: Yeah, I think what I mean, I just emailed her again a few days ago, but I will check with the folks actually over in DPW in the forestry department to see if maybe I can get ahold of someone else, maybe, or even just talk to our DPW commissioner, if need be, just to sort of maybe try to move this along a little quickly. Because I mean, as we sort of didn't quite say what we said, that we're going to continue this anyway. So if I can do that and talk to our commissioner and sort of maybe sort of like a little bit more of a
[Heather]: And can you get an update to us, is that allowable? Can we get a summary of what you've, or do we need to wait for the meeting to hear for that? Is that me? Yes.
[Denis MacDougall]: Yes, no, I can, I'll let you know, I'll let you all know. Like the minute I hear back, I'll just send, I'll let, you know, Mike and Haley know as well, but I'll send, just say, I talked to the DPW and here's what we can do.
[Heidi Davis]: Okay, fine, that's good, thank you. Okay, so to summarize, we are, We need to review the package that came in today. We need to discuss what we would like to see for tree mitigation. We also want to give Mr. DePalma and Ms. Page a chance to speak to the proponent about potential invasive removal plan.
[Craig Drennan]: And then a few extra points on seeing wetland restoration and maintenance in the bordering vegetated wetland that's going to be temporarily impacted.
[Heidi Davis]: Are there any members of the public here that would like to speak?
[Craig Drennan]: Doesn't look like it.
[Heidi Davis]: In that case, do I have a motion I'll take a roll call.
[Craig Drennan]: All in favor?
[Heidi Davis]: And I forgot, it's Caroline, correct?
[Adam Hurtubise]: Yes. Okay, good.
[Heidi Davis]: And myself as an I. And Dennis, when would that be continued to?
[Adam Hurtubise]: It would be December 6th.
[Heidi Davis]: Does it have to be the 6th?
[Denis MacDougall]: No, that's just our normal Does that not work? We could, I mean technically we could meet on the 29th.
[Heidi Davis]: It can't be the 13th, by chance? Can we go? I mean, it could also be then.
[Denis MacDougall]: I mean, I'm not just sort of just going, trying to, because 29th is two weeks away versus, that would be.
[Heidi Davis]: Oh, I'm sorry. I thought you meant December 29th. I'm available on the 29th. Okay. Great.
[Denis MacDougall]: I think Heather might just be checking.
[Heidi Davis]: What does the proponent representative's preference here?
[MCM00001336_SPEAKER_08]: November 29th, I mean, I can be here and I can definitely follow up on a few of these things by then for you.
[Heidi Davis]: Okay, excellent. And in the interim, I'd like the commission to think about if we were to approve this project, how would we condition it? and thank you very much for attending tonight, and we'll see you in two weeks. Thank you so much. Have a good rest of your night.
[Heather]: Thank you. While I was away, what date did you determine? The 29th.
[Adam Hurtubise]: The 29th. All right.
[Denis MacDougall]: Heidi, just one thing, which I'm an apologies to- I will not be here on the 29th.
[Heather]: You have a quorum?
[Denis MacDougall]: Yes. Okay, great. And if Alex is there as well, because he'll just miss tonight, but we can get him up to speed. So just one thing, which I've got Teresa on the call, we had a site, I think it should be relatively straightforward, just about the CPA award.
[Heidi Davis]: I'm so glad you said that, because I've seen Teresa sitting here and I knew it was going to be a fairly brief item. So thank you for your patience, Teresa.
[Theresa Dupont]: I find this all very interesting. So all good. So just a really quick introduction for those who don't know me. My name is Teresa Dupont. I am the newly appointed Community Preservation Act manager, so CPA manager. I'm here today to say hi, as well as to bring up a past award. And I know some of the members here are a little bit newer, but I also know some are very tenured. There was, I believe it was three years ago, an award that, an application that was put to the CPC on behalf by the Conservation Commission for Riverside Avenue stormwater mitigation. That was a $40,000 award. And it has now since, the project is still happening to the best of my knowledge, but it's being taken on by the Medford Housing Authority for the salt and salt renovation there. So the point of me being here tonight is to formally say, you know, if the board agrees to it, that we would love to withdraw that award as such. You guys really don't need it anymore. But I wanted to open up for discussion there. By clawing back this money, it would also go immediately right back into awarding some new applications that Craig and I had the esteemed pleasure of reviewing. So at this moment, are there any questions about this? Do we want to talk about it? I'm here to address anything.
[Heidi Davis]: Basically, the revised plan that the housing authority prepared meets all the functions of what was intended by our grant, I presume.
[Theresa Dupont]: That is my understanding. I can connect with the Medford housing authority. I'm assuming what they put forth before they came before this board. So I myself am not an expert, but I can connect with the Medford housing authority and just ensure that we're all on the same page.
[Heidi Davis]: Well, I believe that we approved that revised system in an order of conditions.
[Theresa Dupont]: Okay, great, sorry, I thought there was a... Yeah, so... Okay.
[Heidi Davis]: I'm just... It's triggering memories now. Yes, we do have an order of conditions governing that work. And so they obviously have to abide by the plans as approved. Okay. Heather or Eric, I'm not sure you were on board when we
[Marie Izzo]: I don't recall an order for this work. I recall discussing the project perhaps more likely after the order of conditions was issued. But no, I don't have any questions. I mean, I assume the scope of work matches what the order requires, so.
[Adam Hurtubise]: Yeah.
[Craig Drennan]: I mean, if the money was awarded and what we approved for the salt and salt improvement does for all intents and purposes, the same thing. Is there not a way to shift that funding to Medford Housing so that they can basically implement the project as was intended by the grant?
[Theresa Dupont]: That's an interesting angle. Let me bring that back to our chairperson who's a bit more tenured in these specific niche scenarios here. If it's getting, if it's still satiating the original ask, I think that that would be sufficient and we could transfer those funds over. Yeah, let me look into that and I'll circle back with Heidi and Dennis and always happy to come back and speak at the 29th again if there are further questions.
[Heidi Davis]: Thank you, Theresa, that would be helpful.
[Theresa Dupont]: Of course. All right. Well, thank you all so much for letting me have a couple minutes of your time. Nice to meet you. Thank you.
[Craig Drennan]: And Dennis, you're muted again.
[Denis MacDougall]: All right, one of these days I'll figure this out. I've been doing it for four years now. Notice of intent, DEP file number 215-0234, Veterans Memorial Park dugout replacement. The Massachusetts Department of Recreation and Conservation has filed a notice of intent to replace the dugouts associated with the Carmine B. Santoro Memorial Baseball Diamond at Veterans Memorial Park event. The proposed work will impact the following inland resource, bordering land subject to flooding and the riverfront area of Mr. Garner.
[Craig Drennan]: And I sit across the hall from Maria and Tom Keogh, who was lead on this project. So I'm going to back out from this one. I'm going to go dark.
[Adam Hurtubise]: I'll be back towards the end of the meeting.
[Denis MacDougall]: Just a little checking that we had lost Caroline. She came back on with another one, just making sure if she is actually here. Caroline, if you are here, could you unmute and let us know?
[Heidi Davis]: Also, just as a note, before we close tonight, we have to, we need to approve a couple of sets of minutes also.
[Adam Hurtubise]: Oh, there she is. All right. Great. Craig has to recuse himself. So we need you, Caroline, as a for quorum here.
[EO-vAhUJAKo_SPEAKER_18]: Sorry, I apologize. My car's in the shop and my ride came and I had to jump out. So I'm not driving, but I'm a passenger in a car. Sorry about that. That's okay. I'm glad you're with us.
[Heidi Davis]: Appreciate your meeting gymnastics. Can a representative for DCR or DCR describe the project, please?
[SPEAKER_04]: Yes, so Maria Johnsonberg from AECOM. We are representing DCR, though Joe Silveira is also here from DCR to help answer any questions or clarify anything. So this is a fairly simple project. I'm just going to share my screen. One second. Hold on. You are good to go. All right. Thank you. Just to make this a little easier. Okay. So just to get you all oriented, this is the location. It's along the Misting Valley Parkway and Winthrop Street is where the Veterans Memorial Park is, and we are specifically looking at the Carmine v. Santoro Memorial Baseball Diamond, which is the baseball diamond in the middle of So with that, the project is to replace the dugouts for that baseball diamond. So here are some photos of the site. good one. These were fairly recently replaced, but they were not replaced correctly. What should have happened is that the old dugout pad should have been removed and then a new one poured. And what happened is that they just poured a new one on top, so it's not level. So the purpose of this project is to fix that. And the plan is to dig out both of the pads completely this time, pour them so that they are at grade with the rest of the field, reuse the existing canopies, and then to restore everything essentially to the existing grade and reseed it to match the existing lawn conditions. I'm going to go back to the other figure that I was showing you. So this red outline is approximately the project area. These are the two diamonds right here. There's a proposed kind of staging area within this, but this whole, almost the entire diamond and the entire work area is within the 200-foot riverfront area of the Mystic River and is also entirely within border and land subject to flooding. And because it's where it is currently located, we can't reasonably locate it somewhere else. That said, we are not increasing the size of either of these pads, and we are not changing the alignments, so the actual impervious area on site is not going to change. And because we are lowering the elevation of the pads to be at grade with the rest of the lawn, it will actually increase the amount of flood storage that is there by about 364 cubic feet. So that's kind of the project outline and what we're intending to do. And unless Joe wants to add anything, I was going to ask the commissioners if you have specific questions about the project and how we're going to do things.
[SPEAKER_05]: Great, I just want to introduce myself. My name is Joey Silvera. I am a regional planner with DCR. Maria, thank you very much for the presentation. I think you did a great job. And that's, you know, we're coming in to to remediate the these dugouts being installed improperly. And so thank you. Thank you, Maria. And thank you for the commission to the commission.
[Heidi Davis]: Great, thank you both. I'll open it up to the commission for discussion.
[Marie Izzo]: I've got a question. What was the work that is recently done that's being corrected? Was that subject to an order of conditions? Was that reviewed by this commission before?
[SPEAKER_05]: It was not, actually, and that's one of the reasons why we're coming here, right? So, yes, it was not. The person who had my position before me, I started in December, left, and so this work went in under sort of a state contract, an FAC 104 contract, and so we're here to to receive permission from you and to remediate this situation.
[Marie Izzo]: Okay. Not to get too far down in the weeds yet, but I guess my question is, so the current surface, the finished elevation of the dugouts is above what was there before. You just poured on top of those existing slabs, right? So do your calculations that the removal, the volume that you're saying is being removed, is that just what was added or is that in total what was there before, if I'm making sense?
[SPEAKER_04]: So the numbers that I provided are the net change, what's there, so that only includes essentially what what is being removed, the newer portion of the pad that's raised up, they are going to take out the old pad that's underneath it because it's degraded, it needed to be replaced, and the work just wasn't done the way it was supposed to be done, the contractor kind of missed the line where they were supposed to take that out. So the volume of the pad underneath the old pad is not included. in terms of volume, but it's going to be replaced essentially one for one with what's new, which is why it's not included.
[Marie Izzo]: Does that answer your question? Yeah, it does. As you're explaining that, my question clarified in my somewhat foggy brain. So, yes, thank you for that. I understand your answer. I appreciate that. I don't know, Heidi, Caroline, Heather, do you have questions you want to fill in at this point?
[Heidi Davis]: I do not. I have a couple.
[EO-vAhUJAKo_SPEAKER_18]: There is a path along the river and that seems to be within the limit of work. Is that path and pathway going to be interrupted during the construction?
[SPEAKER_05]: So, I can answer this no, right? So, there's a walking path, right? That connects all of the properties over here. And so, the limit of work is slightly in the path because of one of the dugout locations, but the path will still be open to the public. And so, there'll still be movement through there.
[EO-vAhUJAKo_SPEAKER_18]: Okay, so it'll be wide enough for pedestrians, bicyclists?
[SPEAKER_05]: Yes.
[EO-vAhUJAKo_SPEAKER_18]: Yeah, and I think the only thing in it that
[SPEAKER_04]: that they can avoid putting in it.
[Marie Izzo]: But to that point, presumably you have to operate equipment down that path to get to the dugouts, correct? I mean, yeah.
[SPEAKER_04]: Do you want to answer, Maria? Well, using the path is ideal in terms of creating less disturbance, but they are going to recede any longer. to go off of the path to meet it or if it's going to disrupt something to use it. I'm sorry Heather go ahead.
[Heather]: I'm just curious how long is this I mean this seems like a pretty quick project to me what are we talking about in terms of time because I think that has an impact on a bunch of other questions like where is equipment going to be stored is it going to be back across the street on the other side of the community garden Do we have any idea how long this will take? I mean, it seems pretty quick and dirty. Dig out, remove, set forms, pour cement, the end.
[SPEAKER_04]: Joe, correct me if I'm wrong, but I think this is probably something that can happen in about a week.
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, absolutely. We have two internal maintenance contracts that are online that I'm managing, and so I'm planning on funding this work through those maintenance contracts. So the contractor is on board. He brings the equipment necessary to do the work with him that morning. At the end of the day, everything gets loaded back on trailers and leaves. So we have a staging area that's more or less for the day. It's for the day, right? And I just wanted to just reiterate the location of this field is central in this area, in this site. And so they will be driving a truck, most likely with a trailer, down the path to the staging area, and then at the end of the day, exiting.
[Heather]: And yeah, I don't... Yeah, there's been a ton of work going on all summer right there and in that area. So, I mean, this is a good time to do it because if you're going to recede, do it once and do it, get it over with. That's the only questions I have. As long as you're taking the equipment away and we're not going to have to have disruption across the street, again, reseed that area again, I'm happy.
[Marie Izzo]: just for my own curiosity, I can't recall, is the path along the dugout, is it stone dust here or is it asphalt? It's stone dust. Yeah, okay. I'm just purely curious. And it's usually covered with geese.
[Heather]: Yes, hope someone's notified the geese, yes.
[Marie Izzo]: Did you identify, I guess I should ask first, are materials being stockpiled on site? So concrete gets broken up. Are they taking that out the same day? Did you identify stockpiling areas in your notice of intent?
[SPEAKER_04]: So this is a picture of the pathway we were all talking about just so that everyone can see it. But here is the... the plan set that was included with the NOI, and this is kind of the staging. There is not a specific stockpile area, but I think that the aging area with purposes depending on what exactly they're doing. If it's the day where they demolish things and take it out, then that's what they will be using that area for and then it gets taken away. If it's the day that they're pouring the new pad, then they will have the materials that they've brought in for the day to do that.
[EO-vAhUJAKo_SPEAKER_18]: That area would be sufficient to store what I'm going to call the roofs of the dugouts?
[SPEAKER_04]: So this fence area, this is kind of the limit of the area that they think they will be working in. So if this needs to move a little bit, as long as it's not in the pathway, then they do have plenty of room on the site to do that.
[SPEAKER_05]: Okay. And if I could just add, right, I had planned on any, you know, during the, you know, we're going to get a construction schedule. I'm going to get a construction schedule from the contractor, right? I will determine with him the days that he's planning on doing removals. Anything that's being removed, right? It's going to be removed that day. Materials that are necessary for that work for that day will be brought that day. You know, and I Caroline, I did not think about where the, the shade structures would be stored. And so they, they, you know, we've, I've been, we've been calling them the East and West dugout. So the East dugout being the one closest to the path that could potentially be, you know, we're gonna have a construction fence around this. And for this short time, it could just be stored right next to where the new pad is going in. Okay.
[Heidi Davis]: Will there be concrete mixed on site? I presume.
[SPEAKER_05]: I mean, I will reread our spec, but it's my interpretation that the concrete would be coming in that morning on a truck and that it would be. Coming off of a truck and not necessarily mixed on site.
[Adam Hurtubise]: Okay.
[Heidi Davis]: Are there any members of the public here that would like to speak? And I should have asked first, does anyone else on the commission have any other questions? In that case, do I have a motion to approve this project as currently before us?
[Marie Izzo]: Yeah, I will make a motion to issue an order of conditions we have any special conditions we wanted to include beyond our standard conditions? I guess I'll leave that as a question. Yes? I believe so, yeah.
[Heidi Davis]: But do I have a second?
[Heather]: I'll second.
[Heidi Davis]: Great. We can discuss the conditions in just a moment, but so all in favor of issuing an order? Heather? I. Eric.
[Marie Izzo]: Hi.
[Heidi Davis]: Caroline. Hi. And myself as an eye. A couple of conditions that come to mind are that. Any demolished materials shall be appropriately removed. I also would like to see a condition about containment of concrete. And I'm looking for an example. Yeah, concrete washout containment specifically. So we don't, oftentimes the washout just gets kind of dumped over the bank.
[Adam Hurtubise]: So there needs to be, it needs to be removed.
[Heidi Davis]: Anything else?
[Marie Izzo]: I think we acknowledge that it'd be in the project spec, but storage of and fueling of equipment would not happen within the limit of work specified in the order, I guess. I think that fueling is probably a standard condition that we have.
[Denis MacDougall]: It is, yeah, there's a fueling, there's one in there about fueling within the- Fueling and spill kits, yeah, I guess.
[Marie Izzo]: I don't know how others feel about the stockpiling of material and debris. If that could be removed from the site on a daily basis, I think that would generally be a good thing. But given the short duration of the project, I don't necessarily see that being an issue. So I guess just requirement that any equipment left on site would be or would not be left on site, I guess, more appropriately.
[Adam Hurtubise]: I'm trying to think.
[Heidi Davis]: So. They'll be additional
[Heather]: Oh, isn't it like 345 or something like that? Not bad.
[Marie Izzo]: Not to move on from that, but I agree. But I also want to ensure, I think Caroline was getting at this earlier, that public access along the pathway is not
[Heidi Davis]: It shall be maintained during construction.
[Marie Izzo]: I'm happy to discuss if that needs to change as the project design is refined, I'd be happy to discuss that, but it doesn't sound like that's a need at this time. So I just want to ensure that that access is maintained.
[Denis MacDougall]: Well, if we put that in there, we pretty much also have in our pretty much standard orders that if there's any changes that need to be made, it has to come, be notified. And so I think that if all of a sudden you're doing it, you're like, oh my God, we have to block this down, that would just be a notification of us.
[Marie Izzo]: Yeah, I guess I was just signaling, I didn't want them to twist themselves in knots trying to figure out a solution. You know, I think we can be reasonable and discuss a solution if it needs to happen.
[Heather]: If I'm correct, it appeared that the fenced off area did not exclude traffic to the left of it. Am I reading that correctly?
[SPEAKER_05]: Yes. Yes, you know, that was 1 of our initial goals and thoughts when we 1st started looking at this and the reason why the, the, the limit of work line is sort of in the middle of the path is that we need to leave enough room for for machinery to move within the construction fence within the area to to construct this if necessary to move things around.
[Heather]: So, that may Eric, does that. sort of relieve any concern you have or lessen the concern you might have about that?
[Marie Izzo]: Yeah, I mean, I think what they've shown on their plans is reasonable. It provides room for, you know, equipment to operate in the limit of work and access. What I worry about is, you know, the contractor gets down there and says, oh, this is a pain, shove that fence over five feet, and suddenly people are creating, you know, new design lines. Such a lack of trust.
[Adam Hurtubise]: That's good.
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, I'll be the project manager. I will be there right? And that was this is 1 of our major concerns from the beginning is not impeding pedestrian access. And, you know, I will, I will be on site. I'd like to also make sure that. There's enough room for a vehicle to potentially get in there to get to ball field 3, if if if possible.
[Denis MacDougall]: we could just start, sorry Heather, we could just sort of condition that, you know.
[Heather]: I'm just saying that while you're there, if you could take a good look at any, what appears to be some cutting in that area, I think we have a few, I don't think they're necessarily neighbors, but I know that there are folks that appear to be doing some cutting in that area. You might just want to check it out, since it is your land.
[SPEAKER_05]: Sure, what are they cutting? Are they cutting
[Heather]: You know, they think there's too many branches, it impedes a view, it's hard to get by. We got a few of these folks in town, it's not just in this location, it's all along the river and I've overheard various conversations at social events so that I know it's still going on and they think they're quite clever.
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, I have a rogue, a vegetation pruner along the Charles Charles River in Cambridge, right, who just in the middle of the night is cutting huge amounts of, you know, for view sheds, you know, but it's not appropriate at all.
[Denis MacDougall]: We had a similar gentleman down along by the back behind the schools in the last few years that let me assure you, let me assure you, Dennis, he is still there and very proud of it. All right. That's good to know.
[Heather]: I have directed him to the Mystic Watershed group and various other groups where he can work these issues out in perhaps a more agreeable manner. But that's not the time for tonight. No. Okay. Are there any other conditions?
[Denis MacDougall]: Because Heidi- We looked at which I was sort of thinking for a condition would be- Do you want to review them? I don't know if you will, is just for another condition is, or just included in there, is that normally we have something in there, you know, for erosion controls, usually I go and check out the erosion controls. If I just, you know, add erosion controls and, you know, fence, like once the fence is put in, I can just go down there and check out to make sure that it's not blocking the path and it's all right, according to what we proposed.
[Heather]: Erosion controls, we've got the cement. We've got the no storage overnight. Was there a fourth?
[Denis MacDougall]: Demolished materials shall be appropriately removed. But I think that might have something similar to that anyway in our conditions, but I will double check to make sure that it's accepted.
[Heidi Davis]: Cement washout shall not be removed.
[Denis MacDougall]: Cement washout shall be removed.
[Heidi Davis]: Two, three, four.
[Denis MacDougall]: I thought there were four, but... The equipment would not be left on site.
[Heather]: Okay, that makes four.
[Denis MacDougall]: Thank you.
[Heidi Davis]: I presume that the plans show erosion controls? Yes. I'm having trouble pulling up the plans right now.
[SPEAKER_04]: Do you want me to share the screen? They are on there. I'm happy to reshare if you like. They weren't on the specific sheet that I shared, but in the subsequent sheets they are shown.
[Heidi Davis]: I think with those conditions, we, as we already voted to issue the order with conditions, I don't see that we need to take a further vote and good luck with your project and thank you for coming tonight.
[SPEAKER_05]: Thank you. Thank you.
[Heidi Davis]: Thank you very much. I'm sorry, Dennis. No, I'll just
[Denis MacDougall]: I think we're done. I just don't read just that. I'll give you a written up soon and get it to you by the next week or so. Thank you. So you get rolling.
[Heidi Davis]: Thanks.
[SPEAKER_05]: Thank you.
[Heidi Davis]: And before we close this here this evening, I think I believe we have 2 sets of minutes.
[Denis MacDougall]: that we need to approve. One other item as well. Electronic signatures. The info that I sent along from... Are you still looking for signatures? No, no, no. It's actually about the use of electronic signatures. I'm just trying to call up the email.
[EO-vAhUJAKo_SPEAKER_18]: Yeah, I think it was just, this had to come across my desk at work, just the procedure for using electronic signatures and it kind of, came resurfaced when the last order of conditions was having trouble at the registry getting recorded, because the registry requires wet signatures. But there is a procedure. If we wanted to do it, we would just take a vote. And it basically enables us to do the docusign that we've been doing. And it says on it, it would be recorded at the Registry of Deeds. and we would note it on anything that needs to be recorded pursuant to general law, I think it's chapter 11G. We took this vote that it's recorded here, you can go see it. It may alleviate some recording issues, as Dennis said. Well, it really depends on the day and the time and the person when you're going to the registry, but I thought it might help Potentially, so I just sent it in.
[Craig Drennan]: Is there any sort of cover letter that we could provide applicants with record of where we to make about. Our authorization of this procedure to hopefully smooth things over to kind of slap it on top of the order condition.
[Denis MacDougall]: Yeah, I think probably if we do this, because then it would get, it says the vote must be signed. Basically, we do the vote, it's signed by the city or town clerk as a true or test copy, and then it's recorded at the deeds, registered deeds. And once we have that in hand, we can just sort of give that to them. That might make it go by a lot smoother, hopefully. I mean, but as again, it depends on the person at the deeds. It genuinely does. It's not even, I wish I was exaggerating about this, but it's, I've been dealing with folks for the last three years, and a lot of times-
[Heather]: But just to cut through, whatever we can do to attempt to make it easier for people, let's just do it. And if it doesn't work, then we'll come in and sign them. But let's try to support our...
[Denis MacDougall]: So basically, I have the language here. So if I kind of read this out, then we just get a vote on this. And then I'll write it up. And then I think that I might actually have to have them come in and actually physically sign. Because I think we might actually need a physical signature. Because I don't know. I'll check on that. I'll actually check with her. But it feels like something that they might. If I bring that in electronically. Sorry. So move this quickly. I'm all in here to sign it. You're good. All right, so I'll strike before I sign it. I might be able to actually sign it. Yep, moving on. So let me just read it out, and then we can just have the vote. So at public meeting, the commission must vote to hereby recognize and accept the provisions of Massachusetts General Law Chapter 111G regarding electronic signatures, and that its members will henceforth execute documents either with electronic signatures or with wedding signatures, and that both will carry the same legal weight and effect.
[Heidi Davis]: Excellent. Do I have a motion to approve? I make such a motion.
[Craig Drennan]: I second it.
[Heidi Davis]: Great. All in favor. Heather? Aye. Craig?
[Craig Drennan]: Aye.
[Heidi Davis]: Caroline? Aye. Eric? Aye. And myself is aye.
[Denis MacDougall]: Let's give it a try. And then now we just have the two minutes that I sent you. And I did make the changes. I just forgot to send it back to you. But the changes that you noted were made.
[Heidi Davis]: Great. Do I have a motion to accept? Can we do both of them or do we have to do separate? I make a motion to accept the minutes as corrected. I second it. Great. All in favor. Was that Heather? Aye.
[Heather]: Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye.
[Craig Drennan]: Aye. Aye. Aye.
[Heather]: Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye.
[Craig Drennan]: Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye.
[Heidi Davis]: Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye.
[Heather]: Aye I'm going to run. Everybody have a really nice Thanksgiving and nice to see you. You too. Why don't you just make a motion to close the hearing? I make a motion to close the hearing. Second.
[Heidi Davis]: Awesome. Everybody, it's unanimous. Aye. All in favor. Aye.
[Craig Drennan]: Aye, everybody.
[Heidi Davis]: Thank you. Good night.
[Craig Drennan]: Happy Thanksgiving. Yes.
[Heidi Davis]: Happy Thanksgiving, everybody. Take care. Bye. Bye.